my dog is dog aggressive and the behaviorist says to use the gentle leader.
what do you think, will me using a GL on the walk overlap to help his dog aggression? (he's never gotten away from me on a leash so that's not the problem..the behaviorist says i need to toughen up with my dog, to be the leader, like using the GL and crating him inside, etc)
I'm just having a hard time using theGL..i end up taking it off during the walk to give him some enjoyment on the walk.
i am the kind of dog person who needs a dog that WANTS a leader. my dog doesn't want a leader, he wants to lead. and i'm not good at it.
it's almost funny. with his GL on, we bump into each other because i'm expecting him to lead ME on the walk out of habit..and he can't lead with the GL on.
but he hates the GL..his head hangs low his tail down. i want walks to make him happy. so it take it off
my q is, will keeping it on help stop his aggression by making me "pack leader"?
Not every dog wants a leader some are dominant and if there is no clear leader they will happily take the job.
No training tool will work if you do not take the role as the leader. If you are going on walks, you should lead the dog, not the other way around.
I am not a fan of the GL but if that is working stick with it and leave it ON throughout the ENTIRE walk. I also suggest you practice NILIF (nothing in life is free) to set clear leadership. The dog should get nothing and that means no play, petting, attention, walks, water or food unless he first perfoms a command that is given. It could be any command like sit, down, wait and etc but nothing should be givem to the dog until he does what is asked.
If you do not set up clear leadership with your dog, your dog could end up biting another dog or a person and that will then cause you big problems.
Good Luck!!!
BTW, I prefer prong collars. I know they look cruel but they are not, they are actually a very good training tool because the prong, when contracted, simulate an alpha dog "biting" the neck of your dog. It is through biting that dogs understand/learn what is acceptable/not acceptable behaviour. The pinch of the prong collar only contracts when the dog lunges or pulls and the pinch makes them stop doing that. You do not need to "pop" these collars (like you do a choke chain) and very little effort is needed from you for a correction. Most dogs walk happily with a prong on and quickly learn while wearing the prong collar and using voice re-enforcement, not to pull or engage in otherwise unwanted behavior.
Dogs can only do and get away with what we allow and they need to be taught what is wanted and expected so they can be good canine citizens.
powered by Yahoo Answers
May 31st, 2009 at 3:41 pm
My dog was not aggressive, but was a huge puller. We tried the GL. At first, I thought it was great, then I saw her response to other dogs. She was so fearful, hiding behind me. Not that I want her to be "tough", but she wouldn't even greet other dogs. I used the choke chain, didn't like it. Then I tried the prong collar. That works well for us, we alternate between that and a harness, depending on the situation.
I really think it depends on the dog and trainer/owner.
Good luck!
References :
May 31st, 2009 at 4:11 pm
In short…No…I do not believe that by you putting a gentle leader on your dog it will make you the pack leader. If that's what your trainer told you…that's just silly. I answered your other question earlier today…and think that you need to work on your leadership…you can do it…even if it doesn't come naturally.
I don't have any gentle leader experience, but they always look really uncomfortable when I see dogs wearing them. A little like their view is blocked. I have no idea what breed of dog you are talking about, but we used prong collars for training ours because they are big strong dogs (that pull a lot). The prong collars seemed to work very well (initially when I saw them…I said no way…I thought they looked like medieval torture devices)
But our trainer recommended it and it worked like a charm.
All said…you have to take over as the pack leader…there is no other option. Using a gentle leader, a prong collar or a choke chain is not magically going to turn you into the pack leader. Just work on it…you'll get it!
References :
May 31st, 2009 at 4:21 pm
Not every dog wants a leader some are dominant and if there is no clear leader they will happily take the job.
No training tool will work if you do not take the role as the leader. If you are going on walks, you should lead the dog, not the other way around.
I am not a fan of the GL but if that is working stick with it and leave it ON throughout the ENTIRE walk. I also suggest you practice NILIF (nothing in life is free) to set clear leadership. The dog should get nothing and that means no play, petting, attention, walks, water or food unless he first perfoms a command that is given. It could be any command like sit, down, wait and etc but nothing should be givem to the dog until he does what is asked.
If you do not set up clear leadership with your dog, your dog could end up biting another dog or a person and that will then cause you big problems.
Good Luck!!!
BTW, I prefer prong collars. I know they look cruel but they are not, they are actually a very good training tool because the prong, when contracted, simulate an alpha dog "biting" the neck of your dog. It is through biting that dogs understand/learn what is acceptable/not acceptable behaviour. The pinch of the prong collar only contracts when the dog lunges or pulls and the pinch makes them stop doing that. You do not need to "pop" these collars (like you do a choke chain) and very little effort is needed from you for a correction. Most dogs walk happily with a prong on and quickly learn while wearing the prong collar and using voice re-enforcement, not to pull or engage in otherwise unwanted behavior.
Dogs can only do and get away with what we allow and they need to be taught what is wanted and expected so they can be good canine citizens.
References :
May 31st, 2009 at 4:48 pm
Gentle Leader = Petsmart Yuppy BS…Yes, you can control the dog better because it twists the dog's head and neck violently to the side, but it's not a training tool…in fact I refuse to call it a tool of any kind. The TOOL you need is older than the choke collar, the prong collar. It's been around for over a century for a reason: It works. It's also safer than "gentle leaders" and choke collars. Choke collars can fully depress the airway, gentle leaders have (just recently) been proven to cause tissue damage in the upper neck. Prong collars only constrict so far which eliminates the chance of fully depressing the airway, and when a German study was done on necropsied dogs trained with prong collars they found "nothing abnormal". Did I mention that it works? A prong collar is like power steering for large/aggressive dogs, your correction can be lighter than one with a choke collar (also reducing the risk of soft tissue damage) and makes it easier for those of smaller stature to handle aggressive dogs. As soon as the dog fixates on another, quick correction at the exact moment he locks eyes on the dog and keep walking. If it's too late and the dog is pulling, reel the dog in to get a bit of slack and correct immediately after (you need slack to give a real correction). If the dog is still showing aggression, up the correction and do it again until the dog completely gives up on the idea he's fighting a winning battle. Make it clear if he shows aggression he'll be corrected! The prong collar gives you the leverage to become the pack leader of a dominant dog who is otherwise too strong for you to handle. The corrections WILL stop his aggressive behavior, and by making it impossible to pull with the reel in, correct maneuver, you're a sure bet on having a fully trained, non-dog aggressive dog! Good luck, feel free to e-mail me with any questions or concerns, I'd be more than happy to help!
References :
I'm a professional GSD breeder/trainer.
May 31st, 2009 at 5:05 pm
You must be the leader!
References :
May 31st, 2009 at 5:51 pm
Putting something on your dog is never going to stop aggression. You can keep his aggression in check and redirect drive through training. I'd suggest a training collar for walks rather than a Gentle Leader. If you need to give the dog a correction, a training collar gives appropriate feedback. A Gentle Leader must never be used for correction, as a correction could cause neck injury.
Alpha theory is quite interesting, but it's not a cure-all. Hard work and perseverance, however, is a darn sight closer to a cure-all.
References :
May 31st, 2009 at 6:03 pm
i train dogs, and while the gentle leader is a good tool it is not a solution. you have to want to lead.
the GL is not a "petsmart yuppie" tool. it actually does what we as humans cannot. it works with natural pressure points that your dog has. there is one directly under the knot on the back of his head that releases good endorphines into the system, the other is on the muzzle which tells the dog he is doing something wrong. alphas in a pack will nuzzle other dogs on the back of the head and bite down on the muzzle in this same fashion. your dog looks unhappy because you are both in a state of confusion. you want to be led and he wants to lead but the GL in your hands does not let him.
dogs who haven't been abused generally don't want a leader. they will take your alpha spot the second you show a weakness. it's just dog behavior.
prong collars are an okay tool if you use them correctly. so many people walk around with neck damage just waiting to happen. if you decide to get one fit it snug so it will stay behind the ears on it's own. it should not slide down the neck. and the prongs are supposed to be on the top of the neck. mother dogs don't try to bite the front of the neck they bite the top to avoid damaging the pup's throat.
the same concept should be applied with a choke collar. Martingails are also great training tools. they are like a choke but the bottom part is nylon and the top is chain, some are all nylon. you want this one to also be tight enough to stay high on the neck by itself. the little rings that the chain loops through should sit behind the ears. tightening this will hit a pressure point there that causes displeasure.
if you don't act happy and in control your dog is going to feed off of it. use lots of treats with your GL and grow a backbone (sorry to put it that way, but it is true) so many people let their dogs walk all over them, and this is a big part of the overcrowded shelter problem. if you can't handle him then find someone who can.
References :
personal experience and research
May 31st, 2009 at 6:14 pm
You're paying a behaviorist and then going to YA for advice on whether or not to follow that person's advice? It sounds to me like you don't really trust them. What kind of qualifications does he/she have? Please find an individual qualified in applied animal behavior. They will probably have a Ph D. Once you have found this individual you need to be honest about what you are comfortable doing with your dog. They will only be able to help if you are willing and able to follow through on what they recommend.
References :
May 31st, 2009 at 7:00 pm
It just might work. Try it out.
References :